Science, Religion definitely don’t mix

Random ramblings and thoughts on history and Christianity.

Why would God allow the Jewish people to be enslaved by the Egyptians?

Why wouldn’t God just change the heart of the Pharaoh, instead of killing all those humans and animals in the time of Moses?

Why did the Jews have to fight to take the ‘promised land?’

Didn’t Jesus know he would be resurrected to sit at the side of God; that he was the son of God, or maybe God himself, if you believe in a triune God.

Radiocarbon dates of less than 10,000 years are very accurate. lots of times can be checked and calibrated against historical records.

30,000?? BC The last Neanderthals die.

25,000 to 20,000BC Someone..is painting murals on cavewalls in France, and making beautiful spear points (Solutrean) that resemble points in later North American (Clovis) points.

10,000 to 5000 BC Humans arrive in Patagonia, South America.

9000 to 6000 BC Paleoindians in Utah using atlatl.

8000 BC Maybe earlier…farming in Asia.

8000 BC Rock carving in Murujuga, Australia.

8000 BC Mammoth kill in Naco, Arizona. Found in 1953, It had 8 Clovis points embedded. Slightly North of Naco, 9 more Mammoths and 13 associated Clovis points..dated to 9000 BC.

7000? BC Milk River Valley, Alberta, Canada. Blackfeet and Shoshone natives carving petroglyph’s.

7000 to 3200 BC Residents of the city of Mehrgarrh, near Indus valley, were farming, smelting metal, herding domesticated animals, flint knapping, tanning and making pottery.

6000 to 5500 BC Farming spread around the ‘fertile crescent.’ of the Middle East.

5000 BC the first farming culture of Central, and parts of, Northern Europe.

4100 to 4000 BC The Garden of Eden. Adam and Eve. No humans elsewhere on earth. Europe, North, Central, or South America, Asia, India, China, Mongolia, Australia, South Pacific Islands… …Empty… according to the Bible

2750 BC The Epic of Gilgamesh. Babylon alone had probably ten thousand people.

2550 to 2500? BC Pyramid of Khufu/Cheops, Other pyramids were soon being built in Egypt. Large population there. Egypt had a different language than Babylon.

2500? BC The Sphinx built.

2500 to 2000 BC Stonehenge being built in England: Population of England probably in the tens of thousands. Large prehistoric city, probably associated to the henge, found in modern times, a mile from Stonehenge.

2250 BC The Flood…8 humans left on the whole planet earth.

2250 to ??? the answersingenesis people think there was another ice age after the flood and the Neanderthals were spawned after that???

2250 BC Egyptian history continues unbroken, as does most of the world. No mention in hieroglyphs of all life destroying flood. Bronze age happening..no signs of interruption.

2125 BC Tower of Babel…probably tens of thousands of people in Babylon alone.

1750 BC Peak of Minoan civilization in Crete.

1515 BC Moses out of Egypt. Approximate population of Egypt probably 2-2½ million. Moses took about 1 million Jews with him…There goes the tax base.

1500 BC And earlier, Mexico was growing maize/corn and messing with corn genetics..and making Tacos? Yum!..Well not making tacos I guess.

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About the word of me
Interested in family and friends,grandchildren, photography, darkrooms, history, archaeology, scuba diving, computers, software, fast cars, journalism, writing, travel, ecology, news, science, and probably most other subjects you could think of. Did I mention family and friends?? I require iced tea or cold brewed coffee and a internet connection to be fully functional. Sometimes there are just so many words in my head they spill out.

10 Responses to Science, Religion definitely don’t mix

  1. empy says:

    Why can’t you see it in a slightly different light? The Bible and science deal with two totally different areas of human life. Science deals with the physical world and the Bible is about the moral world. One without the other is simply incomplete.

    There is no need to find any contradiction between creation and evolution as the Bible clearly says that earth appeared first, then came plant life and it was followed by animal life. Man came to the scene only at the last stage. We see general agreement between the two. I believe that God was behind that evolutionary process which I call creation.

    I say that the Bible has nothing to say about the age of the universe at all. In fact it is only logical for a Bible believer to think that the universe is indeed millions of years old. The word ‘day’ in Genesis could never be understood as twenty four hour day. We say that a day is twenty four hours on earth based on earth’s relation to our Sun. We know that day is not twenty four hours in Mars, for example. According to the Bible the Sun and the moon came to the picture only on the forth stage of creation. How could the day then be twenty four hours before that? Day in Genesis is ‘geological day’ and it could be millions of years in duration.

    That our universe is guided by immutable laws is unquestionable. That every action has its equal and opposite reaction is a universal law of science. This is true both in the physical and in the moral realm. Since every man failed miserably in the moral realm, God in His love has made a provision in Christ which if any one accepts would be beneficial for that individual. If some one does not want that provision, that individual is wholly responsible for his/her actions.

    God to me is not a mere feeling. I transact business with Him on a daily basis. As for me I handed over my case to Christ and He is now responsible for me. My past is forgiven and as I continue to take advice from Him daily, I am strengthened for day to day living. This I did just as I hand over a civil case to an advocate because I can not handle it alone. If some other person can handle it alone, let him/her do it alone.

    Christ to day is my advocate and I know that He is going to be my judge tomorrow. I think it is very wise on my part to hand over my case to today’s advocate who is going to be tomorrow’s judge. What do you think?

  2. thewordofme says:

    See new column empe.

  3. Any scripture, whether Christian or otherwise should not be taken as history. They are inspirational writings and only those who have an affinity with the writer can truly interpret it. The story of Adam and Eve is allegorical as is that of Noah and of the other stories. To put the Bible in hands of everyone and expect them to interpret it is a mistake, especially the Old Testament. Even theologians, intellectual and very literate give different interpretations. The true message of the Bible is the found in the life of the mystics, men like St. Francis of Assisi, Thomas a Kemipis, St. Augustine and others.

  4. government control says:

    Hi randall butisingh,
    So, it seems to me you are saying that all or most of the Bible is allegory.
    Adam, Eve, Garden of Eden, Flood, Tower of Babel, they are all bedtime stories, so to speak. Not to be interpreted literally, but as myth.
    Would this be a fair to infer from what you wrote?

  5. sarsen56 says:

    Members of the WordPress community who are interested in Stonehenge may like to see: http://www.sarsen56.wordpress.com

  6. If you’re interested in Science and Religion, visit our conference on December 10th 2008 in Amsterdam. Science and Religion, the Meaning of Life Science.
    Renowned professors from the US, UK and the Netherlands will talk about why Science and Religion (don’t) mix!
    For all information, see: http://www.congocongres.nl

  7. empy says:

    An Atheist Professor of Philosophy speaks to his Class on the Problem Science has with GOD, The ALMIGHTY.
    He asks one of his New Christian Students to stand and . . .

    Professor : You are a Christian, aren’t you, son ?
    Student : Yes, sir.
    Professor : So you Believe in GOD ?
    Student : Absolutely, sir.
    Professor : Is GOD Good ?
    Student : Sure.
    Professor : Is GOD ALL – POWERFUL ?
    Student : Yes.
    Professor : My Brother died of Cancer even though he Prayed to GOD to Heal him.
    Most of us would attempt to Help Others who are ill.
    But GOD didn’t.
    How is this GOD Good then ? Hmm ?

    ( Student is silent )

    Professor : You can’t answer, can you ?
    Let’s start again, Young Fella.
    Is GOD Good ?
    Student : Yes.
    Professor : Is Satan good ?
    Student : No.
    Professor : Where does Satan come from ?
    Student : From . . . GOD . . .
    Professor : That’s right.
    Tell me son, is there evil in this World ?
    Student : Yes.
    Professor : Evil is everywhere, isn’t it ?
    And GOD did make Everything. Correct ?
    Student : Yes.
    Professor : So who created evil ?

    ( Student does not answer )

    Professor : Is there Sickness ? Immorality ? Hatred ? Ugliness ?
    All these terrible things exist in the World, don’t they ?
    Student : Yes, sir.
    Professor : So, who Created them ?

    ( Student has no answer )

    Professor : Science says you have 5 Senses you use to Identify and Observe the World around you.
    Tell me, son . . . Have you ever Seen GOD ?
    Student : No, sir.
    Professor : Tell us if you have ever Heard your GOD ?
    Student : No , sir.
    Professor : Have you ever Felt your GOD , Tasted your GOD , Smelt your GOD ?
    Have you ever had any Sensory Perception of GOD for that matter ?
    Student : No, sir. I’m afraid I haven’t.
    Professor : Yet you still Believe in HIM ?
    Student : Yes.
    Professor : According to Empirical, Testable, Demonstrable Protocol, Science says your GOD doesn’t exist.
    What do you say to that, son ?
    Student : Nothing. I only have my Faith .
    Professor : Yes. Faith . And that is the Problem Science has.
    Student : Professor, is there such a thing as Heat ?
    Professor : Yes.
    Student : And is there such a thing as Cold ?
    Professor : Yes.
    Student : No sir. There isn’t.

    ( The Lecture Theatre becomes very quiet with this turn of events )

    Student : Sir, you can have Lots of Heat, even More Heat, Superheat, Mega Heat, White Heat,
    a Little Heat or No Heat.
    But we don’t have anything called Cold.
    We can hit 458 Degrees below Zero which is No Heat, but we can’t go any further after that.
    There is no such thing as Cold.
    Cold is only a Word we use to describe the Absence of Heat.
    We cannot Measure Cold.
    Heat is Energy.
    Cold is Not the Opposite of Heat, sir, just the Absence of it.

    ( There is Pin – Drop Silence in the Lecture Theatre )

    Student : What about Darkness, Professor ? Is there such a thing as Darkness ?
    Professor : Yes. What is Night if there isn’t Darkness ?
    Student : You’re wrong again, sir.
    Darkness is the Absence of Something.
    You can have Low Light, Normal Light , Bright Light, Flashing Light . . .
    But if you have No Light Constantly, you have Nothing and it’s called Darkness, isn’t it ?
    In reality, Darkness isn’t.
    If it is, were you would be able to make Darkness Darker, wouldn’t you ?
    Professor : So what is the point you are making, Young Man ?
    Student : Sir, my point is your Philosophical Premise is Flawed.
    Professor : Flawed ? Can you explain how ?
    Student : Sir, you are working on the Premise of Duality.
    You argue there is Life and then there is Death, a Good GOD and a Bad GOD .
    You are viewing the Concept of GOD as something finite, something we can measure.
    Sir, Science can’t even explain a Thought.
    It uses Electricity and Magnetism, but has never seen, much less fully understood either one.
    To view Death as the Opposite of Life is to be ignorant of the fact that
    Death cannot exist as a Substantive Thing.
    Death is Not the Opposite of Life : just the Absence of it.
    Now tell me, Professor, do you Teach your Students that they Evolved from a Monkey ?
    Professor : If you are referring to the Natural Evolutionary Process, yes, of course, I do.
    Student : Have you ever observed Evolution with your own eyes, sir ?

    ( The Professor shakes his head with a Smile, beginning to realize where the Argument is going )

    Student : Since no one has ever observed the Process of Evolution at work and
    cannot even prove that this Process is an On – Going Endeavor,
    are you not Teaching your Opinion, sir ?
    Are you not a Scientist but a Preacher ?

    ( The Class is in Uproar )

    Student : Is there anyone in the Class who has ever Seen the Professor’s Brain ?

    ( The Class breaks out into Laughter )

    Student : Is there anyone here who has ever Heard the Professor’s Brain, Felt it, Touched or Smelt it ? . . ..
    No one appears to have done so.
    So, according to the Established Rules of Empirical, Stable, Demonstrable Protocol, Science says that
    you have No Brain, sir.
    With all due respect, sir, how do we then Trust your Lectures, sir ?

    ( The Room is Silent. The Professor stares at the Student, his face unfathomable )

    Professor : I guess you’ll have to take them on Faith , son.
    Student : That is it sir . . .
    the Link between Man & GOD is FAITH.
    That is all that Keeps Things Moving & Alive.

    NB:
    I believe you have enjoyed the Conversation . . . and if so . . .
    you’ll probably want your Friends / Colleagues to enjoy the same . . . won’t you ? . . .
    Forward them to Increase their Knowledge . . . or FAITH

  8. Dave says:

    That was a good conversation – slanted in favor of the Student, who got in the last word.

    The student made some mistakes. We haven’t descended from monkeys – they and we descended from a common ancestor – we’re evolutionary cousins. The Student and the Prof each lose a point, the latter because he didn’t catch the error.

    And the Student is wrong to suggest, “no one has ever observed the Process of Evolution at work.” Of course we have – flu viruses mutate – evolve – all the time. Here’s a quote from an online Washington Post , Jan. 12, 2006, about Bird Flu:

    ” Preliminary tests show that the strain of bird flu virus that has stricken at least 15 people in Turkey has EVOLVED in a way that could make it somewhat more hazardous to human beings”

    Emphasis mine. There are many, many, many examples that demonstrate the visible process of evolution, and not just with entities as small as a virus. And there are the geological and archeological records to ably demonstrate that over time – vast amounts of time – change does occur in a species. So much change occurs that new species arise.

    For example, coyotes and wolves are separate species – they don’t interbreed – and yet they share a common ancestor. Wolves evolved in Eurasia, and coyotes in North America. Wolves later entered North America. And the ancestor of both the wolf and the coyote is long extinct.

    Again, the Student errs when saying, “Cold is only a Word we use to describe the Absence of Heat.”

    We use the word “cold” in conjunction with the word “hot,” not “heat.” Heat, in a scientific sense, measures a temperature. The Prof missed this, so a point is deducted from each of them again.

    When it comes to the Prof’s brain, our Student turns out to be quite a dunce. For it IS possible to see the Prof’s brain, and we’ve seen countless other brains, in photographs, at autopsies, with x-rays and ultrasound, when a bomb blows someone’s skull off, etc., etc, etc.

    Leonardi de Vinci peered into an open skull. Go here for a look at some drawings of the brain by de Vinci:

    http://www.davinciandthebrain.org/brain.jsp

    We can be pretty confident, even if our ignorant Student isn’t, that the Prof. has a brain, too. We know that from lots of empirical evidence. Now, perhaps this Prof. is robot without a brain (controlled by someone with a brain in another room), or a sneaky alien who has no need of a brain at all . We could find out if our suspicions were raised – EKGs, x-rays, an alien autopsy, etc., could tell us the truth about this odd Prof. who seems both rude and ignorant.

    By the same token, we can use empirical evidence – lots of it – to demonstrate George Washington existed. When it comes to Jesus, there is no such empirical evidence – none. Christians can only believe he existed on faith, not evidence.

    We can use empirical evidence to conclude the continent of Australia is where it’s supposed to be. No evidence for the continent of Atlantis exists.

    And while we do have evidence the universe exists, empirical, testable evidence of the universe and all sort of things contained within – coyotes and wolves and our brains, and even our thoughts (which are electro-chemical reactions we can chart), we have no evidence for a god, and no way to test for a god. According to the Old Testament, we can’t even see god – lucky Moses was only allowed a look at his god’s ass.

    When the Student – and even the Prof. – finally realize there is no god, everything will begin to make sense. A god can only exist in our brains, as electro-chemical reactions. And if the Student and the Prof. though about it a little more, they’d figure out the god we’ve created in our brains, the one we’ve also written about in the Old and New Testament, is but a projection of ourselves, the human species.

    Grades: an F to both the Prof. and the Student.

  9. thewordofme says:

    Hi Empy, thanks for writing.

    The story, as you know, is seriously flawed.
    Modern day science can prove it’s work…religion cannot.
    Religion can never prove its self…it must be taken on faith.
    If it cannot prove its self it is not factual.

  10. thewordofme says:

    Hi Dave, again thank you for your contribution.
    We all need to keep telling people that religion is just myth, and belief in a sky fairy is not logical.

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