Why are there still Christians?

The birth of the Christian religion is filled with secrecy, intrigue, deaths, torture, outright lies, and misdirection. There was no (and still isn’t) easy path to what we now know as the Christian faith. It took hundreds of years and the death of many innocents. There have been innumerable additions and falsehoods to Scripture. Many mistranslations…or at least many sects say so…they all want their own “world view” or “brand” of theology to be the dominant one.

Modern Christians fight as much nowadays as they did in 1 to 500 AD. The controversy never ends, it seems. They metaphorically stab each other in the back on a daily basis. They may not speak out on the pulpit against Jehovah’s Witnesses, Baptists, Pentecostal, or whatever they’re not. But, boy do they ever when like-minded ones gather informally. The Trinitarian clique badmouths the non-trinitarians and vice-versa. Catholics look down on JW’s, Baptists look down on Unitarians. The cacophony is deafening; there is no ending in sight.

They all claim to be “The Way” to everlasting, eternal life. They witness that “their” interpretation is the only true path. If disagreed with, they spit and sputter. If you try to reason with them their brains shut down and they deny common facts and truths. Walk up to a reader and believer in the Left Behind series of books and tell them you think the Rapture is bogus, and the idea that millions of people will suddenly fly up into Heaven is absurd, and you’d better stand back and prepare to defend yourself.

I’ve known religious people all my life and you wouldn’t believe how many will hardly sit still for a fictional show or documentary depiction of religion that crosses their faith.

They all seem to be worshipping a different God. They follow different paths to get to the same place….they think. Trouble is your path is wrong and you’ll never make it. One wonders, because of all this confusion, if the whole thing isn’t wrong…a misdirection of the intellect as it were.

How can anyone seriously defend something that has had two thousand years to settle in with the human psyche and is still in an internal uproar, and is not accepted by two thirds of the world population? Why, if all of this is the God’s honest truth, 🙂 is there so much dissent out there…so much unbelief and cynicism?

If, it’s all true, why do today’s science discoveries throw sooo much doubt on sooo many of the stories? Why do so many of the biblical scholars have so many doubts about things that Christians swear by?

I’m really confused and I doubt that I’ll be unconfused anytime soon.

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About the word of me
Interested in family and friends,grandchildren, photography, darkrooms, history, archaeology, scuba diving, computers, software, fast cars, journalism, writing, travel, ecology, news, science, and probably most other subjects you could think of. Did I mention family and friends?? I require iced tea or cold brewed coffee and a internet connection to be fully functional. Sometimes there are just so many words in my head they spill out.

37 Responses to Why are there still Christians?

  1. Jared says:

    Why are there still Christians? Because there is still a Christ. http://www.hoodfamily.org.au

  2. thewordofme says:

    Hi Jared, thanks for writing.

    OK, Who has him? Who’s going to be saved? Tell me why you think that, please.

  3. Joel Hansen says:

    Hey, I don’t know you, but I just wanted to say this is a really good post. Just to let you know, I am a Christian, and believe in the Bible. I believe that the only way to heaven is through Jesus.

    On this issue, I’m in the same boat as you are. I have no idea why there is so much division in Christianity. I mean, why does it matter if there is a rapture or not, or we believe in predestination or free will? I guess it’s just the stubbornness of people. They get hung up on their own theology rather than the gospel. Maybe the whole “dying to yourself” thing that Jesus taught got pushed to the side a little bit.

    I’m a member of a non-denominational evangelical church, and we have leaders with many different theological views. We all agree on Jesus, but on the other things… I guess we agree to disagree.

    Trust me Joel, there is no rapture. –thewordofme

  4. Justin says:

    The question is what is truth? It does not matter to you about all the arguing, Bill. Just read the Bible and figure out what is true,

  5. thewordofme says:

    Hi Justin, Thanks for your reply

    I’m reading said book. So far I believe that most of Genesis is nothing but myth.

    Genesis hints that the man/earth is 6,000 years old–not true.

    Genesis says there was a world wide flood–not true.

    Genesis says that man’s different languages originated at Babel–not true.

    The walls of Jericho were probably already flat by the time Joshua got there. 300 years earlier

    I learn that the beginnings of the Bible were pretty shady and hugely questionable.

    I learn that lots of the writing was by people other than those on title.

    I learn by research, that after 2000 years, there is still just as much controversy among the ranks of believers as there ever was in 33AD

    How can I figure out what is true if I can’t even, at this point, discern how many different stories there are out there.

    They may all believe in God and Jesus, but they all disagree on the route to belief.

    If God is the “one True God”, where is the “One True Way”?

  6. Justin says:

    Pick one and we can go with it. However, you will always be able to find a problem with the Bible that we can wrestle with, figure out, and move on to the next one and then you’ll eventually die. The truth is you need to be saved and the bible will come alive to you. if you do want to pick an issue to go through, then that’s fine with me.

  7. thewordofme says:

    Hi Justin,

    How many different interpretations have formed into separate sects that think all the other ones are wrong? i.e. where does one go for the truth?

  8. Justin says:

    The Bible. I joined a church that I believe closely follows the Bible.

  9. thewordofme says:

    But Justin, the Bible is not true.
    Do you believe in Genesis?

  10. thewordofme says:

    Then you and I are worlds apart. This is probably an unbridgeable gap as you are (In my opinion) believing in some things that demonstrably never happened. You still believe in magic.

    There are a number of people out here in the web who have de-converted. Actually the number is growing. From 1990 to 2001 the number of non-believers has almost doubled in the US.

    But, I will assume that you are in the middle ground and will go on preaching and believing in myth and magic.

    So we are at stalemate. We have to play another game. 🙂
    I hope all is going well with your studies and life.
    “Bonne chance, mon ami”

  11. Justin says:

    What if you are wrong?

  12. thewordofme says:

    Then I die….
    What if you’re wrong? Then you die…..:-)

    I have no doubt I’m right…there is too much physical proof for my side.

    You, however believe in magic. Magic doesn’t work, never did.

  13. Justin says:

    If you die and are wrong about Christianity, you will spend eternity in Hell according to the Bible.

    My belief is that there is a Creator who created the creation and will judge us.

  14. thewordofme says:

    There is no hell. It’s a myth.

    Just what would a creator want to judge us about; how much we “glorify” him?

    A real God doesn’t care about “glorifying” Thats a human myth perpetuated by the clergy class to get victu….er…parishioners into the pews. Gods don’t care about that kind of stuff, or if they do they are kinda egotistical…don’t you think.

    And if there truly is a “loving God” out there, why would he want to send billions of humans to suffer the eternal agony of burning alive?

    Your theology does not compute. You’ve had bad input so you are putting out bad output.

    Why would God do the stuff he is reputed to do? The God as imagined in the Bible is from early superstitious unschooled people who had no knowledge about how the world really works. A ten or twelve year old of today understands more about the world than the most educated citizen of Christs time.

    These are old superstitious myths. Show me a demon, or angel or magic.

  15. Justin says:

    You said “There is no hell” but my question is what if you are wrong so it is stricken from the record. 🙂

    “A real God doesn’t care about “glorifying” ” Again, what if you’re wrong?

    “And if there truly is a “loving God” out there…” He is not only loving, he s just.

    “These are old superstitious myths.” What if you’re wrong?

  16. thewordofme says:

    Then my friend I am wrong.

  17. Justin says:

    And what will happen to you as a result of being wrong?

  18. Jason says:

    “Genesis hints that the man/earth is 6,000 years old–not true.”

    Actually, Genesis does not hint at any such thing. At least not in it’s original language which is Hebrew. The word that has been translated as “day” in genesis actually means “an unspecified amount of time”. The problem is a translational error that is common when going from Hebrew to Greek to Latin to Greek to English which is the typical path for most English translations.

    Science, on the other hand, actually agrees, at least partially, with the “standard” reading of Genesis. The Big Bang theory states simply that in the begining of our universe all matter was condenced into a single point. There was an explosion and that sent matter flying out in all directions from the point of origin. Einstein’s Theory of Relativity tells us that he further matter moved away from the point of origin, the slower time got. In other words, it could have been six literal days (24 hours) at the point of origin, but 4 billion years on Earth.

    “Genesis says there was a world wide flood–not true.”

    Actually, there are mountains (no pun intended) of evidence that suggest there really was a world wide flood. The primary evidence is both anthropological and geological.

    Anthropological evidence: Every single civilization on earth has a flood story. These stories are still passed down from their ancestors to modern people today. There are also tons of ancient pictographs, cave paintings, and writings that detail this flood. If you take out all the various religious symbology, every one of them is virtually identical. Even with the religious symbology there is scarcely 25% difference between the two furthest apart.

    Geological evidence: The Grand Canyon is a perfect example. It used to be though that the GC was formed over millions of years by wind and water. When you have soil that dates as 10 million years old on top of soil that dates 2 million years old, something is seriously wrong. Scientific experiments designed to simulate the way the GC was thought to have formed have failed to reproduce similar effects.

    But scientific experiments using large volumes of water of a very short amount of time, similar situations have been recreated. There are even animal (a type of salamader to be exact) tracks that cannot be explained by anything other than an animal walking on the bottom against a strong current. The angle of the tracks plus the orientation of the feet tell them how hard the animal had to work to make it across.

    “Genesis says that man’s different languages originated at Babel–not true.”

    There is anthropological (FYI: Anthropology is a science) evidence that states otherwise. It is possible to trace back each ancient language (modern derivatives and polyglots such as English do not count) to a relatively small area on the planet. While it is not known (at this time) exactly where the Towel of Babel stood, this area is in the general vacinity.

    “The walls of Jericho were probably already flat by the time Joshua got there. 300 years earlier”

    History says otherwise. Writings of the time, by both Jews and Gentiles, tell a far different picture. The geographical clues given in the Bible help to identify the time period that Yehoshua was there. There are writings that were made by other peoples that document Yehoshua and the army destroying the walls.

    Science and the Bible agree in many more areas than you think. In fact, science has not proven a single aspect of the Bible wrong.

    And for the record, I’m not a Christian either. I’m a Jew.

    JASON…See latest post for answer to this—thewordofme

  19. SuperJesus says:

    @Justin: Pascal’s Wager begs belief in some sort of god because we have an overwhelming fear of death and desire to explain the unknown. There are almost too many problems with that tired argument but let’s just check the main problems off.

    1) Just because a story about a loving god and heaven is somehow comforting doesn’t make it true.

    2) Which religion or God is the right one? There are so many to choose from and since a belief in a generic God isn’t good enough I somehow have to pick the right one. I presume you have made your choice and you in turn believe all the others are false, but what if you accidentally picked the wrong one? Unless you have some real evidence to support your decision you appear to be in the same basket as me.

    @Jason: 6,000 – 10,000 years is generally derived from the genealogy lineage cited in the Bible…so-and-so begat so-and-so begat…etc. The margin of error in that estimate is the same as claiming the distance between NY and LA is about 18 feet.

    As for your geology claims, you really need to get a real geology book written by someone other than a young earth creationist.. I don’t care how much water you pour on a granite slab over 40 days you’re not going to make the smallest dent much less a grand canyon. For that it takes millions and millions of years.

    Great blog here. Stop by my page and say hi anytime.

    Super J.

  20. Karl Nova says:

    God is not a man or a woman

    God is love

    God has given us freedom of choice so the choice is yours and I don’t think it is right for anyone to try to make you do anything you don’t to do or believe in something you don’t want to believe in.

    I place my faith in God who’s nature I perceive as love

    even human love is illogical so I don’t try to use logical arguments to make anyone believe anything

    I don’t believe Genesis is literal the bottom line is that the universe has beginning and a cause of that beginning. I believe the world began with a big bang and the cause of that had to be a powerful being with a mind that brought intelligent design.

    God is love if only believers could show such unconditional love to each other and even to those who don’t believe like them

  21. thewordofme says:

    Hi Karl Nova, thanks for writing.

    You Write: “I believe the world began with a big bang and the cause of that had to be a powerful being with a mind that brought intelligent design.”

    So you believe a God made our world using magic?

    Do you also believe that God made Adam and Eve about 6,000 years ago ?

    Do you also believe that the physical evidence we find on earth suggesting life being millions of years old, and the earth being billions of years old?

    You write: “I place my faith in God who’s nature I perceive as love.”

    Numbers 25:4 4And the LORD said unto Moses, Take all the heads of the people, and hang them up before the LORD against the sun, that the fierce anger of the LORD may be turned away from Israel.

    There are hundreds of places in the bible where God causes innocent men, women, and children to die horrible deaths.

    He is not really a God of love…that is just brain-washing performed by the local ministry.

  22. Justin says:

    Bill, can we pick back up on the question what will happen to you when you die if you are wrong and Christianity is correct?

  23. thewordofme says:

    Hi again Justin. Sure, anytime you want.

    If I’m wrong then I’ll have to stand up and take it like a man. I made my choice.

    You are arguing from a point of fear. Refer to your debating class. Doesn’t work on me.

  24. Justin says:

    Actually, I can’t save you. Just making sure you understand.

  25. thewordofme says:

    I am well past redemption.

  26. Justin says:

    Ha. Don’t be cocky. There are better sinners than you, I’m sure of it. Flee to the mercy of the cross where Jesus said “it is finished” and let the price of sin be paid to your account.

  27. thewordofme says:

    Hi Justin,

    Ha, what price, what sin, what account?
    I’m not much of a sinner, unless I’m judged against a Baptist or Pentecostal God. Then I’m a goner. 🙂

    Well, actually if I’m judged by Catholic, Lutheran, Presbyterian, Methodist, or Episcopalian Gods, I’m up the creek.
    The only one I’m likely to squeak by is the Unitarian God. Thank goodness for diversity. 🙂

  28. Justin says:

    Bill, humble yourself – at least for a moment.
    The price – death and if you die in your sins Hell
    The sin – every time you break God’s law
    Your account – You can be set free if the perfection of Jesus is applied to you

    The only God that matters is Creator and the Creator is described in the Bible.

  29. Karl Nova says:

    I don’t believe God made the world by magic. Scientists say the world came into being with a big bang. I believe the being we call God is the cause of that.

    I don’t believe the earth is 6, 000 years old. I believe the Genesis account of creation is a mythical rendition of creation. I don’t discount what scientists have to say and I don’t pretend to have all the answers too like I don’t believe scientists have all the answers! LOL! Scientist approach the search for earths origins from one direction and religious approach it from another direction, I take the middle path where they meet. (not many agree they meet but people like Einstein and Stephen B. Hawking end up refering to God in their searches)

    Quoting just a portion of the Book Numbers without taking into account the whole bible doesn’t make God any less a God of love at all. That’s like someone using only a day that you got angry to judge your whole character. (I know that is a weak example but you catch my drift) If you feel a sense of injustice at the passage in Numbers you quoted then it is a good sign to me because God who is a more supreme being than you and I must be concerned about justice too

    I don’t just use the bible as my only reference point for faith. There is a lot of clues around you I also see a lot of truth in many different religions and so on and so forth. Even you answering me makes believe in God more because I feel you on rejecting the concept of God as put forward in such simplistic terms (e.g the earth existing for only 6,000 years or God being love based on just the example you gave in Numbers)

    God made man in his image and man has returned the favour and this is why I am have lost my religion though I have kept the faith. I am well past religion too. I am trying to convert you either I am well past doing that, in my younger years I used to try to do that how foolish I was for trying! LOL!

    curiosity killed my CATechism and I have put down my DOGma too! LOL!

  30. Karl Nova says:

    oooops I meant I am NOT trying to convert you! LOL! could that be a Freudian slip? Maybe! hahaha! but I am not trying to convert you!

  31. thewordofme says:

    Hi Karl Nova…good to hear from you again.

    Even a big bang without God as the cause, smacks of magic to me. My thought is that it will always be a mystery to us humans. 🙂 The only thing I am sure of is there is no Christian God…now that means a God that sets up and follows the melodrama of sin and redemption that the Christian Church follows.

    There may well be Gods, but they would not be so vain and stupid as Christianity puts forward.

    Probably most of Genesis is a human construct…never happened that way…at all. Yet more than a few Christians insist that it IS true, down to the last detail, despite overwhelming proofs. I think the problem is that people will accept something they grew up with, or they accept what those people around them follow, and they just refuse to search any further; they shut down their intellect. They are the ultimate example of closed mindedness.

    I can refer you to many more examples of the Old Testament God being evil. The Numbers lines I quoted just came to mind easily.

    If you read the Old Testament critically you find that the Hebrew Yahweh, Elohim, Jehovah, El. or whatever you want to call Him, is very infantile…at least the way the Hebrews portray Him, and he goes around killing people a lot. He makes bad decisions, is sorry for what He made, or did, can’t fight against iron chariots, and just generally seems to be a human created, bad example of a God.

    All the truths, taken together, undeniably point to the Christian God being made up by Man. Actual modern type humans lived on the earth for maybe a hundred thousand years, and yet God didn’t make an appearance until 1500 to 1200 BC…What’s up with that? Oh yea, He has never shown up since then either.

  32. Karl Nova says:

    God is not a christian! haha!! it is written by the most pre-eminent Christian Paul that “we know in part” so no matter how much Christians claim to know they only have a fraction of the full picture.

    Myths are reflections and projects of humans but they are echos bouncing off their minds from where? I don’t claim to know such is the mystery of life.

    I agree in part on your comments on the Old Testament but The Bible is a WHOLE book and as far as I can see it is a book of progressive revelation. It kinda looks how your perception grows from being an infantile child to a full grown man if you catch my drift. How come you only focus on the old testament. How about the God Jesus reveals? even the hebrews refused to accept this new revelation and killed him!

    I agree with you most “truths” are projections of the soul of men but this only shows that the soul of man is from a deeper source.

    I like to call that deeper source God! LOL! God has always been and always will be

    In him/her you live and move and have your being. How do you keep breathing right now? how did you get life in the 1st place? 🙂

  33. thewordofme says:

    Hi Karl Nova, nice to hear from you again.

    The God of the Old Testament is a Jewish/Hebrew God.
    The God of the New Testament is a reinvented Jewish/Hebrew God.

    Below from Wikipedia.
    Christian testimony was entirely oral for roughly twenty years after Jesus’ death. Christians passed along Jesus’ teachings, proclaimed his resurrection, and prophesied his imminent return. Apostles established churches and oral traditions in various places, such as Jerusalem, Antioch, Caesarea, and Ephesus. These traditions gradually developed distinct characteristics. (But, nobody wrote of him when he was alive, or for 20 to 30 years after.)

    When those who had heard Jesus’ actual words began to die, Christians started recording the sayings in writing. The hypothetical Q document, a collection of Jesus’ sayings, is perhaps the first such record

    Paul’s epistles
    At about the same time, Paul of Tarsus also began writing (or dictating) letters (“epistles”) to various churches that would later be considered scripture. Paul articulated the first Christian theology, that all people inherit Adam’s guilt and can only be saved from death by the atoning death of the Son of God, Jesus’ crucifixion (What this is saying is that Paul basically invented Christianity as we know it.)

    In the Gospels, there are inconsistencies both among the three Synoptic Gospels (Matthew, Mark, and Luke), which provide similar narratives of the ministry of Jesus, but also contain significant differences; and between the Synoptic Gospels and the Gospel of John, which provides a strikingly different description of Jesus’ career. . From Wikipedia

    If Christianity is true…there should not be all the questions and inconsistencies internally…and externally all the different sects that proclaim “they are the true church” They are all different and all of them can’t be right.

    The only explanation that makes logical sense is that they are all wrong.

    God did not have to have a beginning, but everything else does? Can’t seem to wrap my brain around that. 🙂

  34. Justin says:

    How pathetic is a “god” you can completely understand?

  35. Karl Nova says:

    Hi Justin how are ya man? I’m really enjoying our exchange it’s really cool!

    You saying if Christianity is true there should not be all questions and inconsistencies internally would be correct if everyone interpreted truth the same way and if everyone didn’t feel the need to enforce their interpretation of truth on everyone.

    Logical sense cannot always be applied to everything because not everything makes logical sense I’ll give you some examples, love or “falling in love” doesn’t make logical sense. You being alive right now or your heart beating just like that without you controlling it doesn’t make logical sense. It just beats.

    On you comment about God not having a beginning I agree with you it makes no logical sense and I can’t wrap my brain around it too! 🙂 I don’t claim to understand God or even have a total picture on truth! If one could totally understand God totally then it wouldn’t be God. Men don’t even totally understand themselves! talk less of women! LOL!

    I guess my brain was not meant to. You are more than a brain so I guess there is a part of you that can intuitively feel things out like “being in love” or other illogical things that happen. (I know the being in love might be a bad example but I know you get what I’m saying! LOL!)

    If you can peep this book my Deepak Chopra (I by no means use this book to show my total beliefs but this book is VERY good! trust me!)

    the book is called “How to know God” It is fascinating and it is not a “christian” book! LOL!

  36. Karl Nova says:

    oops I mistook Justin for thewordofme! sorry whatsup anyway y’all!!!!!!!!! LOL!

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